Clays & 45 ACP

[MW surveyor]

Does any one have a good load for Clays (just Clays, not Clays Universal) under a 200 grain LSWC?

Made 20 test rounds up using 3.6, 3.9 and 4.2 grains of Clays each last week and shot today . The 4.2 were the best as far as accuracy with a spread of about 3.5" but nowhere near what I get using 4 grains of Bullseye where I get a spread of about 1.75".

Thanks.

[TonyT]

hen I used 200 gr. LSWC for bullseye pistol matches it was the Speer 200 gr. LSWC and 3.6 gr. Clays for ca 720 fps.

[MW surveyor]

Thanks

[wyntrout]

Every time I see the thread title, I think... shooting clays with a .45 acp??

Wynn:D

[MW surveyor]

Every time I see the thread title, I think... shooting clays with a .45 acp??

Wynn:D

Yeap! Started shooting Frisbees, then the mini ones and now on to clays. After I get good with shooting the clay pigeons with the 45, I'm gonna go to lifesavers :D

[mightymouse]

Yeap! Started shooting Frisbees, then the mini ones and now on to clays. After I get good with shooting the clay pigeons with the 45, I'm gonna go to lifesavers :D
So dumb question with the lifesavers, how do you now if you hit them in the center?

Tums, tic-tacs, aspirins, when will it end? :)

[MW surveyor]

So dumb question with the lifesavers, how do you now if you hit them in the center?

Tums, tic-tacs, aspirins, when will it end? :)

Its really tough getting a 0.451" bullet through a 0.25" hole, but it can be done with a lot of bullet lube. :D

[Planedude]

I use to shoot falling plate with my 1911. I loaded 3.2 grains of clays under a 230grn round nose lead bullet. You could just about take a sip of coffee waiting on the bullet to ring the plate. The load was the lightest that would work the slide everytime.

Of course accuracy was "hit the one foot plate anyplace that would knock it over..." :D

Fun times, I miss that club.

Good luck with finding a load and please give a range report when you find one that works.

[MW surveyor]

Planedude,

May go ahead and load up a few 3.2 gr and 3.4 gr. Problem is that if they are not accurate or start to lead up.........IBPO

[MO_Soldier]

I'm going out with clay pigeons, my Mossberg 500A tac modded, and my PM9. I report with my luck shooting them lol

[Planedude]

Planedude,

May go ahead and load up a few 3.2 gr and 3.4 gr. Problem is that if they are not accurate or start to lead up.........IBPO

Well, at that volocity, they never leaded the BBL...:rolleyes:

I don't remember if I ever did a full on paper target accuracy test or not with that load. I remember I showed up for the monthly falling plate contest with the first batch and my bone stock "GI" 1911 having never put a round at that loading thru the gun before. Took second place in "B" class that day, down just one plate to several very good shooters. I thought, "well, thats a good load" and kept reloading them that way. I had been shooting another guys "bullseye" handloads but they were nearer to full house power with 4.9grns of powder. They had alot more recoil that was slowing me down on the plates.

My receipe for shotshells has always been the same. Win AA hull, 18.5 grns of Clays, Win 209 primer and 1 1/8oz of #8 shot in a windjammer wad. Shoots all my 16yd Trap targets and fills all my skeet needs. When I shoot long handicap with my buddies, I just buy a couple of boxes of "super" loads at the club. Why try and reload different?

Good luck on the search.

[MW surveyor]

I use 4.0 grains of Bullseye for my BE target loads. Plenty accurate, recoil is pretty mild too. Probably could back the load off a bit to maybe 3.8 or 3.9 but.....the 4 grains are getting the job done. Did load some at near max but follow-up shots suffered.

[TonyT]

Does any one have a good load for Clays (just Clays, not Clays Universal) under a 200 grain LSWC?

Made 20 test rounds up using 3.6, 3.9 and 4.2 grains of Clays each last week and shot today . The 4.2 were the best as far as accuracy with a spread of about 3.5" but nowhere near what I get using 4 grains of Bullseye where I get a spread of about 1.75".

Thanks.
When I was using the 200 gr. Speer LSWC for bullseye pistol my load of 3.6 gr. Clays, WLP provided ca 720 fps - a mild and accurate load. Currently I use a 185 gr. LSWC with 3.8 gr. HS-700X. RemLP for ca 715 fps - also accurate and very mild but not as clean burning as the previous load.

[Bongo Boy]

I've not loaded SWCs but I've shot a bajillion 200 gr RNFP (round nose flat point--Lee mold), and most of them with Clays. These guys:

http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x150/Bongo_Boy/Handloading/45ACP208.jpg

In going through my notes, I can't piece together too much of any value other than: very low charges in the 3.2-3.5gr range seem a bit wild as far as chrono statistics, although I don't know for a fact that translates to poor groups. The only load I had positive reactions to was 4.4 gr ...which I see now is actually .1gr above Hodgdon's published max. However, while we'd normally not expect a potent load to be all that accurate, Hodgdon's 45ACP max loads are pretty weak near as I can see.

I was encouraged enough by Nitro 100 in both 40SW and 45ACP that I bought an 8 lb jug of it last week, and plan to do some real load workups and comparisons. I've seen it produce chrono stats nearly identical to Clays for identical charge weights, but I seem to find sweeter sweet spots with it.

Have you loaded WST for accuracy in 45? I'm anxious to see if it does anything special.

[MW surveyor]

Never used the WST (yet).

[mr surveyor]

what about AA#7? I know it's not "economical" (10-11 gr), but does it perform well? I've started with Unique, and it actually performs pretty well in the .45 acp, although a bit "sooty" as expected.

I have no problem with buying a powder specifically for my new .45 load needs, but don't want to "experiment" a lot. I'm hoping y'all come up with the perfect powder/load combintation and save me from buying a lot of powders that will end up on the shelf unused.

[MW surveyor]

Gee, thanks. Let all of the others do the work and you reap the benefits. ;)

[CJB]

Accuracy... not only the charge, but many times the sizing, and the seating of the bullet. This has to do not only with the "pistol" at large, but in a more refined way, the particular chamber, and barrel hood of the individual barrel and slide you've got.

IOW, one man's dream load may be another man's scattergun load.

[Bawanna]

I've been using Winchester 231 in my 45 target loads 230 gr Precision Delta. They are accurate enough but they are dirty. I too was impressed enough that I bought a 4lb jug a few years back. Now I'm not as impressed as the cases to come out really dirty and black.

I used Winchester 452AA in my shotgun loading days. I still have an untapped 8# keg of that. Wish it would work in a 45. Actually it might, I haven't looked very hard yet for a load.

[MW surveyor]

I used Winchester 452AA in my shotgun loading days. I still have an untapped 8# keg of that. Wish it would work in a 45. Actually it might, I haven't looked very hard yet for a load.

I did a google search and there are indeed some loads for 452AA in 45 out there. Too many to do a cut and paste here. Also, as with just about any powder/bullet, the grain weight loads are just about all over the place.

[Bongo Boy]

I've not done AA7, but have done #2 and #5. Most recently I burned through a bottle of AA2, and I wasn't able to do much with it, really. I certainly can't say the powder was the problem, by any means, but I was getting a bunch of 1.2"-1.5" 5 shot groups (freestyle) at 7 yds. I was only able to pull together a single 1" group at that range, freestyle. These were all with 185 gr plated hollow points, 5.7 gr of AA2.

The AAx powders are really attractive because you'd expect these tiny little ball bearings to just meter like magic, and I'm sure they do. I know the repeatability of the loads is quite special. But as mentioned, there are plenty of other factors to spoil things, and I'm not convinced charge weight OR bullet weight are necessarily the most influential in the big scheme of things.

In any case, one potential issue with the AA2 and AA5 in a progressive press: it's like each case on the shellplate is a tiny little Martini glass filled to the rim. That stuff will fly out of the case if you look at it wrong. It's pretty amazing--they require a little more care than any other propellant I've used.

[mr surveyor]

it's not the most economical, but as soon as I can extinguish a few job related fires and get my head screwed back on to it's normal 3 degrees out of plumb, I'm going to cook up a few of the 230 gr Bayou Bullets with a 10gr load of AA#7 and give it a try. I do like that powder in my magnum revolvers, particularly with jacketed bullets.

I'm sure to end up with the conventional favorites for the .45 acp sooner than later, but even though it's not the best for everything (or possibly anything anymore), I'll always have a stash oh Unique available. It's useful in everything I load for. Actually, TrailBoss "works" in everything too.

So, what's the final verdict on Clays?

[MW surveyor]

Jury still out on the Clays. Seems to do OK but I've not really shot enough of the various loads to make a decision. Been fooling around with the other guns too much.

[Springer]

Just going to throw my 2cents in on this. I have switched to Clays with 9mm & 45acp and am quite satisfied with the results. It is Very clean and uses less than most other powders. I load 124gr 9mm, and 230gr 45acp.

[garyb]

The 4.2 were the best as far as accuracy with a spread of about 3.5" but nowhere near what I get using 4 grains of Bullseye where I get a spread of about 1.75".


I've read that Bullseye is known for its better accuracy. I have not tried it, but my instructor uses it in his 40 for IDPA with great success and he swears by it. I tried to buy some when I originally picked up powder, but they were out. So I bought Longshot. I will make the switch to Clays or Bullseye when I am out of the Longshot and give them a try.

[MW surveyor]

Just going to throw my 2cents in on this. I have switched to Clays with 9mm & 45acp and am quite satisfied with the results. It is Very clean and uses less than most other powders. I load 124gr 9mm, and 230gr 45acp.

So, what type of bullet (Lead or FMJ) and how many grains of powder are you using?

[Springer]

I have only loaded either FMJ or JHP. Not sure how well Clays would work with lead, never tried. Loading data is on Hodgdon's website. I usually load upper/mid range and am happy with accuracy and recoil, plus it's cleaner.

[Bongo Boy]

I've seen several comments regarding Clays being smoky when used with lead bullets. I have not had this experience, and it doesn't make much sense to me to blame lead bullets for much of anything, especially not smoke. However, I do know lots of folks really like bullet lubes that contain carnauba, beeswax and other stuff that I would expect to smoke with fast, hot powders.

I use a very hard lube that, AFAIK contains no wax at all, and I don't notice smoke. The day is a long way off where smokey loads will impact my IDPA scores. ;)