Magazine release spring

[getsome]

Hello all, Went to the range over the weekend and my CW40 started to drop the magazine on the last round and the slide wouldn't lock back...I talked to Kahr this morning and they are sending me a new and hopefully improved release lever to install...Well leave it to me to make an easy job hard...:32:...I finally managed to pry the spring the right way and got the lever out (still not sure how I did it) anyway the spring fell out and after several hours on hand and knees I finally found it...It is a very small round piece of metal about 2 inchs long and about the size of a toothpick....My question is, what holds the spring in place and have I messed up the polymer and how do I go about putting the thing back in...I know I know it's supposed to be a no brainer to do but like I said I'm no gun smith and being half blind with a bad hand and trying to work on the thing with a flash light in my mouth is frustrating to say the least.....Is the spring supposed to come out or should it be a press fit into the polymer or glued in place?....Is it time to send her back to the mother ship?... Any tips would be very much appreciated....Thanks guys...:confused:

[gb6491]

The spring is a press fit into the polymer, the magazine catch (when installed) prevents it from working out of place.

If you look down into the mag well, you will see a wedge shaped cavity in the front strap (just below the magazine catch). There is a hole into the polymer at the bottom (small end) of the wedge. Hold the spring with some needle nose pliers or a hemostat, then insert the spring into that hole; use enough pressure to just get it started. Release the spring, it should lay pretty flat and parallel to the front strap; put a pin punch on the visible end of the spring and push it completely into place. Look through the magazine catch round hole, the spring end should be about half height (or slightly lower) in the hole. To install the catch, start the catch slightly, pry and hold the spring away from the front strap, push the latch into position, release the spring and slide the end of it into the cutout on the magazine catch; done.

There are some photos in the following link that show (probably much better than I tried to explain it) the spring installed and how to install the catch: P45 Repair - Glock Talk (http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1038570)
Regards,
Greg

[getsome]

Thanks Greg, Thats what I was hoping to hear....I called Kahr back this morning and asked for a new spring and its on the way so I will install it and the new release at the same time....Man that little spring is SMALL!!!!....I seem to have a knack for having springs fly apart or little pieces fall out into the twilight zone whenever I try and fix something....Last night I was cleaning my 1911 from the weekend shoot...First the recoil spring collet cover or whatever you call it flew out and hit me right between the eyes...:eek:...Next attempt the #*&%&$ thing flew across the room somewhere yet to be found...:32:....Anyway I sure appreciate the help, Ya gotta love this place!!!!...Thanks again and hopefully after this fix I won't have to operate on this problem any more....

[Bawanna]

The spring is a press fit into the polymer, the magazine catch (when installed) prevents it from working out of place.

If you look down into the mag well, you will see a wedge shaped cavity in the front strap (just below the magazine catch). There is a hole into the polymer at the bottom (small end) of the wedge. Hold the spring with some needle nose pliers or a hemostat, then insert the spring into that hole; use enough pressure to just get it started. Release the spring, it should lay pretty flat and parallel to the front strap; put a pin punch on the visible end of the spring and push it completely into place. Look through the magazine catch round hole, the spring end should be about half height (or slightly lower) in the hole. To install the catch, start the catch slightly, pry and hold the spring away from the front strap, push the latch into position, release the spring and slide the end of it into the cutout on the magazine catch; done.

There are some photos in the following link that show (probably much better than I tried to explain it) the spring installed and how to install the catch: P45 Repair - Glock Talk (http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1038570)
Regards,
Greg

I assumed pretty much what you said here, very much like a glock but didn't want to give bad info without looking at mine. Is that spring so loose that it actually relies on the mag release lever to hold it in place. Turn the gun upside down it could fall out? The glocks take some effort to get them out and I've never had a reason to take one out. Now I gotta take a first hand look at this, not that it makes a whole lot of difference. It ain't going no place when assembled. Just curious is all.

[gb6491]

Bawanna,
I had to give the spring a tug to get it out.
That was true of the spring I replaced and the replacement spring (yeah, I pulled it once to compare it with the original). I mention that becuase the original spring in my CW45 was of smaller diameter wire than the replacement spring.
Regards,
Greg

[Bawanna]

Bawanna,
I had to give the spring a tug to get it out.
That was true of the spring I replaced and the replacement spring (yeah, I pulled it once to compare it with the original). I mention that becuase the original spring in my CW45 was of smaller diameter wire than the replacement spring.
Regards,
Greg

Thats exactly what I kind of figured. SOOOOOO Getsome, fess up dude? How did you get that spring to jump out of there without a little help. Wonder if you got the new spring size hole and the old smaller diameter wire spring? I'm not gonna lose a minutes sleep over this but I just couldn't and still can't figure out how that spring would jump out of there.
Curiosity has been the undoing of many far better men than me, maybe I'm addicted to puzzles?

[jfrey]

Bawanna, I was thinking what you said that the setup is very similiar to a Glock. I took my mag release out one time to lube it and the spring stayed put in the frame. It was a pretty good trick to get it out the first time but I finally figured it out and got it back in with no problem. It never hurts to keep a few of those little parts on hand just in case. The part that worries me the most is loosing that little spring in the sear block. You never would find that one.

[snuffy]

I seem to have a knack for having springs fly apart or little pieces fall out into the twilight zone whenever I try and fix something....

Next time put the gun into a large plastic ( gallon size zip-lock ) bag before ya try to remove a spring. That way way you won't loose it if the spring gets away from you.

[Bawanna]

Next time put the gun into a large plastic ( gallon size zip-lock ) bag before ya try to remove a spring. That way way you won't loose it if the spring gets away from you.

That's pretty much standard procedure when working on the safety of a Beretta. Lots of tiny little springs that fly all over the place. Good plan anytime your in doubt.

[getsome]

Well truth is I don't know how I managed to get the thing to fall out, I'm lucky I heard a little ding when something hit the bench and I had no idea what fell out until I noticed the spring was gone!!!...:2eek:...I probably should have just left it alone as I was getting aggravated with it and tried again later...Sometimes its best to walk away for a while or ask for help and hopefully one day I'll learn that ....Anyway last night I looked at it again with my geezer glasses on and in a better light and tried again armed with new knowledge....I found one end of the spring is hollow and the other end is solid...I put the hollow end into the hole in the frame and pushed it in and it seemed to stay ok...(hope thats the right way)...I messed with it a bit and got the release back in just to see if I could....Turns out its like everyone says, its a piece of cake once you get the hang of it....I asked the rep at Kahr if the new spring is the same diameter of larger and he didn't know but when it gets here I will mic it to see.....Thanks for all the help guys, y'all rock!!!...:cheer2:

[Bawanna]

Well truth is I don't know how I managed to get the thing to fall out, I'm lucky I heard a little ding when something hit the bench and I had no idea what fell out until I noticed the spring was gone!!!...:2eek:...I probably should have just left it alone as I was getting aggravated with it and tried again later...Sometimes its best to walk away for a while or ask for help and hopefully one day I'll learn that ....Anyway last night I looked at it again with my geezer glasses on and in a better light and tried again armed with new knowledge....I found one end of the spring is hollow and the other end is solid...I put the hollow end into the hole in the frame and pushed it in and it seemed to stay ok...(hope thats the right way)...I messed with it a bit and got the release back in just to see if I could....Turns out its like everyone says, its a piece of cake once you get the hang of it....I asked the rep at Kahr if the new spring is the same diameter of larger and he didn't know but when it gets here I will mic it to see.....Thanks for all the help guys, y'all rock!!!...:cheer2:

I walk away/ roll away alot when I get aggravated. Sometimes coming back gives you a new perspective or something occurs to you while your doing something else and just saves the day, sometimes not. I find myself rolling away more and more all the time. I wonder if aggravation adds up with mileage. I see now the old man on the porch barking at everything that walks by. Maybe this mystery is solved.
I'm just glad you got it all back together and figured out. I'm still perplexed how that spring could fall out without pursuasion but for now we'll chaulk it up as one of lifes little mysterys.

[hobbydad]

I recieved a new spring to go along with a new steel magazine release for my PM9. It was a larger diameter, and actually quite a bit longer, approx. 1/8". I had to cut it to fit, but was more than happy too do the extra work required for the larger diameter. The original spring was not loose, but the new spring is definetly in there.

[getsome]

Thanks for the heads up hobbydad, Did the new spring have a hollow end and a solid end?... Did you cut it with pliers or wire cutters?... Does anyone know if the hollow end goes into the frame which seems right to me but since I didnt look at it good before it fell out I'm not sure....I hope to get the new lever and spring in the mail today so I can work on it tonight....Thanks to everyone for your help.....Gotta love this bar!!!...:cool:

[Bawanna]

Thanks for the heads up hobbydad, Did the new spring have a hollow end and a solid end?... Did you cut it with pliers or wire cutters?... Does anyone know if the hollow end goes into the frame which seems right to me but since I didnt look at it good before it fell out I'm not sure....I hope to get the new lever and spring in the mail today so I can work on it tonight....Thanks to everyone for your help.....Gotta love this bar!!!...:cool:

I've searched high and low trying to find a definitive answer on the hollow end versus solid end position with no success. Numerous places say when the spring was replaced it was thicker and held better just as you've said.
Being intimate with Murphy and planning for the future I think I would put the hollow end of that spring in the frame first in hopes that if it ever broke that hollow section might give a tiny advantage towards getting the broken section out. I seriously doubt it would ever break but you gotta plan for the worst. A call to Kahr might be the best answer here unless looking at the new replacement spring yields an obvious answer. One end larger than the other etc. If we cross our fingers maybe the packaging would even indicate which end goes where, ya think? Not holding my breath. I'm wondering if hobbydad ran into an obstruction or the spring just wouldn't go all the way in for whatever reason. Don't know why Kahr would supply that spring knowing it needed to be cut. No big issue as hobbydad found but I would sure try installing it first which of course you would have to in order to determine if the length is correct or not in the first place.

[jocko]

Hell I never even knew one end was hollow. Wonder why that is even? How far hollow is it even???

[Bawanna]

Hell I never even knew one end was hollow. Wonder why that is even? How far hollow is it even???

It sounds like it's a relatively new thing jocko. Didn't your people tell you? I'm clueless as usual. Wondering why they would want it to be hollow in the first place and why round versus flat?

[getsome]

Hey jocko, Its not but maybe 1/32 then there is something in there thats light gray like glue maybe?....Don't know..... I may just have an odd ball...Oh well when the new one comes I will let y'all know....Thanks again everybody...

[hobbydad]

Neither spring, new or original, had a hollow end. Both where basically solid pins. I used a dremel to cut down the length, it's my go too tool.

Edit: At first I did assume Kahr had ment for the longer spring to be seated further into the frame. I seated it solidly, and gave it a good tap with a punch. It wasn't going in any further than the original pin, so it had to be cut. I had thought about simply putting the original pin back in, but decided I wanted the larger diameter. I figured Kahr/Ian had changed it for a good reason. Possibly for the switch from a polymer mag release to a steel mag release?

[gb6491]

Neither spring, new or original, had a hollow end. Both where basically solid pins...
Same here, both solid end to end. I did look at the old one with a magnifying glass; no way to tell how it was cut other than it was done squarely and the edge was beveled.
Regards,
Greg

[Bawanna]

This is sounding way better now and as it should be. getsome has to have a fluke or perhaps an end of the run piece or something which would explain why he's having an issue in the first place.
Nothing to gain by that piece being hollow for sure.

[getsome]

Well I received the new release lever and I cant see any real difference between it and the old one but I installed it with the original spring and it does seem that the magazine is tighter...I didnt get a new spring with the replacement lever so I called Kahr and asked for a new one...Yesterday I got a package in the mail but it was another lever with no spring so I think I will leave well enough alone and see how it works as is...Hopefully it will be ok but if not I will call back again for a new spring but I gotta say, this amature gunsmith gig is getting a little old.....

[jocko]

u don't need a new spirng, they never wear out, if it breaks that is different. I had slide not locking open issues with my P380 and I changed slide lock lever, new mag springs, new followers, was running out of ideas. I have never had a mag accidently release from any of my kahrs, but I did notice on my P380 that if I pushed up on the bottom of the magazine the slide would lock open every time like it should. So kahr sent me a new mag release and yes it looked basicaly the same but it also seemed to lock my magazine better and also it solved my slide not locking open issues. So sometimes something can be a tad out of spec and cause things to happen. The mag spring and mag lever are two separate part numbers, . I personaly would not bother about the new spring thing, but that is your call. If it works now, leave it alone..

[getsome]

Thanks jocko, I'll go shoot it this weekend and see how it works....I have a good feeling its going to correct the problem...Now if Ruger will get my LCP fixed and back home I'll be a happy camper again....I thought about trading the CW40 and LCP in for a PM9 but all the shops around here say business is awful and they are not taking in any trades until it gets better...This really surprised me because I thought the gun business was going like gangbusters...

[jocko]

Thanks jocko, I'll go shoot it this weekend and see how it works....I have a good feeling its going to correct the problem...Now if Ruger will get my LCP fixed and back home I'll be a happy camper again....I thought about trading the CW40 and LCP in for a PM9 but all the shops around here say business is awful and they are not taking in any trades until it gets better...This really surprised me because I thought the gun business was going like gangbusters...

in the U. S. news where guns and ammo sales in 09 was over 9.5 billion. Gun busness is good, damn good, but I would think in 2010 it willbe down a tad but still above 9 billion easily..