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Thread: P938 'Extreme' First Impressions & Initial Range Report

  1. #1
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    Default P938 'Extreme' First Impressions & Initial Range Report

    I picked up my new Sig P238 'Extreme' yesterday. This is my take on this nifty Nine.

    Features common to all Sig P938's:

    • Stainless steel slide on aluminum alloy frame
    • 9mm Luger
    • SAO with ambi thumb safety
    • Night sights - large & useful
    • Front & rear cocking serrations on slide combined with a fairly light recoil spring makes for easy slide racking - my wife finds it quite easy, even when the hammer is down
    • Flatwire recoil spring on solid stainless guide rod
    • Removable grips

    The 'Extreme' model includes three features:


    • An extended 7-round magazine as well as a standard 6-round magazine
    • Black Nitron stainless slide over black anodized aluminum frame with black controls
    • G10 grips with an aggressive texture

    Dimensions. Since many of the small pistol manufacturs use creative ways to quote their dimensions, I've measured both the Sig P938 & the Kahr PM9 several ways: (Kahr PM9)
    Length: 5.9" (5.5)
    Height: 4.0" with std mag, 4.5" with ext mag (4.2, 4.9)
    Width:
    @ Grips 0.93" (0.93)
    @ Slide 0.88" (0.90)
    @ Ambi safeties 1.17" (1.11 @ slide stop)
    Weight: (Kahr PM9)
    Gun only: 15.7 oz (15.0)
    with 7-rd magazine: 17.5 oz (16.5)
    Loaded: 21.6 oz (20.0)
    So, as you can see the little Sig is within a whisker of being as small and light as the longtime standard bearer, the Kahr PM9. Frankly, I'm impressed considering the Sig has a metal frame and a beavertail.


    About carrying "cocked and locked" (Condition One):
    Some folks are bothered by this. Count me among those for quite a while (years). I carried a 1911 for over 20 years in Uncle's service, however we always carried it in Condition Three: Chamber empty, full magazine in place, hammer down. The plan was to draw, quickly rack the slide and then shoot if the SHTF. Well, not only is that slow, too slow, one of the guys in my unit shot his partner in the knee doing exactly that. Seems that there's a strong tendency to put the finger on the trigger under those circumstances, which results in BANG as soon as the round is chambered and the slide is back in battery regardless of where the gun is pointed during the slide racking drill.


    Then, we got issued the M92 Beretta. At first, I thought it was lunacy to carry with a round chambered and no safety engaged. After a brief time, I got used to the idea of a DA/SA pistol and came to like it - a lot.



    Back to the 1911. I started shooting 1911's in IDPA a while back. At first, it was a bit spooky. I was still nervous about cocked and locked and sometimes I even carried both the 1911 and my Sig P238 in Condition 3. But, after a few months of shooting 2K rounds a month from the holster, I got over those concerns as well as getting quite proficient with the 1911 battery of arms. Getting that safety on/off is well ingrained in my muscle memory now.
    First impressions out of the box:

    • Like most Sigs, the P938 just feels good in the hand.
    • The trigger guard is nicely undercut to give a full 2-finger grip with the standard mag while the PM9 has a 1.9 finger grip. That changes to a very comfortable full grip with 7-round magazine. The extended mag looks like a work of art compared to the dorky looking Kahr extended mag. The 7-round magazine also gives the gun a nice round butt which is not only comfortable, it facilitates drawing from a pocket.
    • The checkering on the front strap is the best I've seen on any Sig, including my P226 Elite's and X-Five. Like a high-end 1911, the checkering is aggressive without being painful.
    • The trigger pull is short . . . and on the heavy side. Factory specs are 7.5-8.5#. I measured a pull of 6.91# (average of 20 on my Lyman gauge). Then I measured my Kahr PM9 this evening at 7.05#, so the P938's pull is actually less than the PM9's. That said, the Kahr's trigger is silky smooth compared to the little Sig, but the Sig's trigger will get smoother with use while the Kahr's will unlikely change much with wear.
    • The slide is amazingly easy to rack for such a small pistol rated for +P.
    • The G10 grips on the 'Extreme' model are fairly aggressive. Great for holding the gun, but too aggressive for CCW against bare skin under a shirt. While not normally fond of the 'Extreme' look, the grips do soften the outline of the gun making it possibly more difficult to 'make' should it become exposed briefly.
    • FYI, the Owner's Manual lists an all stainless version @ 21.7 oz with magazine.



    A Brief Range Report: I took the P938 to the Sunnydell Shooting Grounds, owned by an Olympic Champion skeet shooter. Naturally, it's all about shotguns, but they have one lane inside a culvert for pistols. A little bizarre - and loud - but it's close. I ran 50 rounds of Federal Champion 115gr FMJ straight out of the box followed by a magazine of Winchester Ranger-T 147gr.


    • No failures to feed, eject or fire.
    • The magazine did drop prematurely early on, but I believe my thumb hit the mag release.
    • The recoil is definitely snappy, especially with the faster 115 gr load. It felt very similar to my PM9.
    • Double taps would be a real challenge for the average shooter. Any day that I feel like the ability to do a Double Tap is a priority is a day I carry a 1911.
    • The gun never felt "loose" in my hand like my PM9 does. In other words, while the recoil was lively, it never felt like I wasn't gripping the gun firmly enough. I can't quite say the same for my PM9 and there's a reason why my PM40 is covered with grip tape!
    • Just like on my P238, the extended mag on the P938 doesn't pinch the little finger the way Pearce grip mag extensions do.
    • Accuracy? I wore the wrong glasses to the range today, so front sight was a total blur. Maybe next time with my shooting glasses.

    The Future:

    • Continue breaking in the P938 with a variety of FMJ and most of my 12+ different types of JHP. As always, I'll run all of my defensive ammo through the chrono before making the final decision on what loads to carry.
    • Two holsters are on order:
      • IWB: TTGunleather Mike's Special
      • OWB: Fist #7 pancake with dropped front, extreme cant and Kydex lining

    • Smooth Cocobolo grips are on order
    • An extended single-side thumb safety, just like my 1911's is also on order. The OEM thumb safety is a bit small to work quickly/easily. And I don't like ambi safeties on carry guns because they make it too easy to unintentionally disengage the safety.
    • As soon as the thumb safety arrives, it's off to the Sig Armorer for a 5# trigger job and installation of the extended thumb safety.

    Bottom Line? It's a keeper.
    :33:







    Sig P938 "Extreme"





    Left to right: Sig P238 "Rosewood", Sig P938 "Extreme" Who knew the cost of carrying a 'Nine' would be so little more that carrying a 380?




    Left to right: Kahr PM40 with CT and lots of grip tape, Sig P938 "Extreme"




    Left to right: Sig P938 "Extreme", Dan Wesson "Guardian". A Commander-size 1911 with a 4.25" barrel; also in 9mm.

  2. #2
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    That is an excellent report, OF. Makes me think seriously about trading my CM9.
    Very interesting...


  3. #3
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    Thanks.

    The wife bought a CM9 a while back, then sold it to a friend who later traded it back for one of her J-frames - so the CM9 is back in the safe. Next to the PM9 that's also for sale.

    Maybe I'm a snob, or maybe I just like good stuff but I prefer the PM9 over the CM9 just because the slide is finished so much nicer. That, and I like my carry guns black because a small black gun isn't as readily noticeable if the cover garment fails to cover for a moment. And I like night sights in my defensive guns. Details matter and the fact of life is that details cost money.

    So, the Sig P938 wins hands down over the CM9 in my book. The PM9 comes much closer in practical terms, but it's still lacking in three significant areas:

    1. Full 3-finger grip
    2. Ease of racking the slide - a major issue for many of the gals
    3. Aesthetics

    The Kahr's major advantage is a simpler battery of arms. Fortunately, training can reduce that advantage to insignificant.

    Quote Originally Posted by JFootin View Post
    That is an excellent report, OF. Makes me think seriously about trading my CM9.

  4. #4
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    I like my 938, but still carry the cm9 more than it due to the safety. I prefer a dao pistol for sd, and until I get that plastic trigger out of the sig I won't carry it.
    Focus on your front sight..... The rest should be blurry!

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    Maybe I'm a snob, or maybe I just like good stuff but I prefer the PM9 over the CM9 just because the slide is finished so much nicer.
    Oh, I dunno. I think my CM9 looks passable.

    View my SLIDESHOW.
    Very interesting...


  6. #6
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    I know what you mean about a DAO for self defense. Personally, I prefer a good DA/SA like a Sig. In fact, our home defense guns are Sig P226's and S&W 686's. All with Custom Shop/Performance Center triggers so the actions are lighter & smoother than production, yet still factory.

    my primary home defense pistol is a Sig P226 Elite Stainless in 40. Their Custom Shop gave it a very smooth 7.6# DA pull followed by a 3.6# SA pull with a short reset. Pretty much perfect for a defensive trigger. But, at 43.0 ounces empty and 55.5 ounces fully loaded, it's tank.

    Unfortunately, the P239 is Sig's smallest & lightest DA/SA. The P239 SAS Gen 2 keeps popping up on my wish list, but it's comparable to my Commander 1911 in size and weight. I'm seriously considering it, but . . . Either way, the 1911 and the P239 are like two sizes larger and heavier than the CM9/P938 class - more than I like to carry regularly.

    I had a S&W 3913NL with a DA/SA trigger. While it was lighter and thinner than the Sig, the trigger was among the worst I've owned, plus it was a PITA to clean. We still have the wife's 3913LS, though.

    Since I'm not willing to carry a heavy service gun regularly, I have to make compromises and the trigger is one of those compromises. Three of my CCW guns are Kahrs and two are 1911's (including the pseudo 1911 P938). Since I shoot a custom 1911 with a 3# trigger regularly, as well as two competition M&P's with 3.1# triggers, I'm pretty comfortable with ability to handle a 4-5# SAO safely when the SHTF.

    OTOH, I "discourage" my wife from carrying either of her 1911's or the Sig P238/P938 until she practices enough. She really likes both of her 1911's so this is a good incentive to get her to practice more. In the mean time, her CCW choices are the S&W 3913LS, Sig P232SS and her 2.5" S&W 686 357 Magnum at home - all DA/SA guns.


    Quote Originally Posted by bonjorno2 View Post
    I like my 938, but still carry the cm9 more than it due to the safety. I prefer a dao pistol for sd, and until I get that plastic trigger out of the sig I won't carry it.
    I didn't mean to imply that the CM9 is an ugly gun - Glock has a patent on that. I simply meant that the PM9 is more aesthetically pleasing because of the nicer machine work on the slide.


    Quote Originally Posted by JFootin View Post
    Oh, I dunno. I think my CM9 looks passable.

    View my SLIDESHOW.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by OlympicFox View Post
    I didn't mean to imply that the CM9 is an ugly gun - Glock has a patent on that. I simply meant that the PM9 is more aesthetically pleasing because of the nicer machine work on the slide.
    I know. I was just taking the opportunity to show off my custom mirror polished CM9, and to point out that the mirror polishing looks better on the uninterrupted facets of the CM9 slide than it would on the machined lines of the PM9 slide.
    Very interesting...


  8. #8
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    That makes sense, but where are the pix????

    I didn't like the half-arsed polish/brush job on my Springfield, so I polished the slide with 800 W&D paper and sanded the rough edges with my orbital sander (poor man's melt). It gets 10X as much attention at matches as my Nighthawks that cost twice as much.










    Quote Originally Posted by JFootin View Post
    I know. I was just taking the opportunity to show off my custom mirror polished CM9, and to point out that the mirror polishing looks better on the uninterrupted facets of the CM9 slide than it would on the machined lines of the PM9 slide.
    "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
    George Orwell
    Kahr's: K9, PM9, P380
    SOB's: 1911's, Sig's, Smith's . . .

  9. #9
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    Anytime you copy a John Moses Browning design you can't go far wrong.
    Never trust anyone who doesn't trust you to own a gun.

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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by OlympicFox View Post
    That makes sense, but where are the pix????
    That Trophy Match is beautiful!

    Did you not click the link to my SLIDESHOW? Here is one pic from it...

    Very interesting...


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