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Thread: Cannot get slide off P380 frame. Guide rod sticks out beyond muzzle. Help!

  1. #1
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    Default Cannot get slide off P380 frame. Guide rod sticks out beyond muzzle. Help!

    Went to the range today with my four month old P380 which I have disassembled and reassembled many times. After shooting about 50 rounds, I got home and wanted to clean the gun, but this time I could not get the slide off of the frame. After some trial and error, I noticed that the recoil spring guide rod was protruding out in front of the slide with the slide at battery. It appears the guide rod is hung up on something. I tried grabbing the guide rod with a pliers and pulled and manipulated it a bit, but the guide rod remains stuck out and I cannot get the slide off the frame.

    I'd appreciate any thoughts or ideas you experts have to offer. TIA!


  2. #2
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    See this thread, http://www.kahrtalk.com/showthread.p...uide-Rod-AGAIN!! . You may have a similar issue.
    Kahr P380
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by XFlyboy View Post
    Went to the range today with my four month old P380 which I have disassembled and reassembled many times. After shooting about 50 rounds, I got home and wanted to clean the gun, but this time I could not get the slide off of the frame. After some trial and error, I noticed that the recoil spring guide rod was protruding out in front of the slide with the slide at battery. It appears the guide rod is hung up on something. I tried grabbing the guide rod with a pliers and pulled and manipulated it a bit, but the guide rod remains stuck out and I cannot get the slide off the frame.

    I'd appreciate any thoughts or ideas you experts have to offer. TIA!

    Position your slide so that that the rear of it is even with the frame (wouldn't hurt to reset the the trigger).
    Now, pull and hold the trigger to the rear of it's travel.
    With the trigger held back, try removing the slide...you probably need to rock and twist it while doing so..a little force may also be needed



    Regards,
    Greg
    [<a href=http://i43.tinypic.com/2n7fnux.gif target=_blank>http://i43.tinypic.com/2n7fnux.gif</a>

  4. #4
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    Thanks for pointing out that thread Topgun. 12 pages long will take me a while to get through, but I am already discouraged by what I see on page one. I am not going to try to modify the frame with a dremel tool while the gun is still under warranty. Before I force anything or break something, I am thinking now I should just send it back to Kahr for repair. Since even if I were able to fix it, what would keep it from happening again? I feel the gun is either damaged or defective. I am hopeful Kahr can tell me what the cause of the problem was, since I had previously fired about 300 uneventful rounds through this gun.

  5. #5
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    Thanks for the post and pics Greg. I did give it one last try based on your instruction, but there is remarkably little wiggle room in this slide to play with. With the slide stop out and trigger pulled, the slide moves about a quarter inch forward of flush with the frame and then it hits a brick wall. There is absolutely no give whatsoever. See my post above. If someone has to put this gun in a vice and pound it with a hammer to break it free, I'd rather it be done at a service center where they will have the parts to repair the potential damage.

    Thanks again,
    Brian

  6. #6
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    I'd try tickling the trigger. LIke what Greg said but pull the trigger and release and maybe pull it again.
    After many many take downs I still get the brick wall from time to time. Tickle the trigger and she'll come off.

    I doubt there's anything wrong just a learning curve. But again, you do what your comfortable doing.
    http://bawanna45.wix.com/bawannas-grip-emporium#!
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by XFlyboy View Post
    Thanks for the post and pics Greg. I did give it one last try based on your instruction, but there is remarkably little wiggle room in this slide to play with. With the slide stop out and trigger pulled, the slide moves about a quarter inch forward of flush with the frame and then it hits a brick wall. There is absolutely no give whatsoever. See my post above. If someone has to put this gun in a vice and pound it with a hammer to break it free, I'd rather it be done at a service center where they will have the parts to repair the potential damage.

    Thanks again,
    Brian
    Brian,
    Hang in there!

    There's not much the slide can hang up on, so let's look at those.

    Barrel: with the slide stop in and the pistol in battery, make sure the barrel is is up to it's full height. At this point, the lower lug should clear the frame and the barrel hood should have it positioned correctly to remove the slide. Note: with the pin out, when you release the striker the barrel may drop slightly, but it should cam back up when you move the slide forward (the front of the lower leg is angled enough to do this when it comes into contact with the frame).


    Recoil spring and guide rod: Normally these should not interfere with removal of the slide. As you state your guide rod is sticking past the front of the slide, that suggests to me that the spring and rod maybe resting ahead of it position in the frame or a spring has slipped over the head of the guide rod. The first instance should not interfere with removing the slide (unless it prevents you from moving the slide far enough to reset the trigger). In the second case, I guess it would be possible for the open end of the spring to hang up on the frame in a way to make the slide difficult to remove. The only solution I can think of for this is to force the slide off.

    Cocking cam: the cam must be positioned with the cocking lobe down. The proper way to do this is to reset the trigger, then pull and hold the trigger back. This is usually done by cycling the pistol before disassembly, but it can also be done by just pulling the slide to the rear until you hear a click (about .5" to .75" slide travel). What this does is release the striker so it is ahead of the cocking cam and holding it down allows the back plate of the slide to clear the cocking cam as you move the slide forward.
    My P380 resets the trigger at about this point:

    If you can get to this point, the cocking cam should not be causing any issues with removing the slide.

    On the remote chance that the cam's striker block lobe is interfering, you can release the trigger at this point and the cam should be free to move as you push the slide forward. If you need extra pressure at this point, I finding using the thumb of my off slide hand helps:


    What I would like to suggest is this:
    Start over.
    Ignore the guide rod for the moment. I don't think much can be done about it right now (you know some photos of it might be a help).
    Put the slide stop back in and reset the trigger.
    Remove the stop.
    Get yourself a good overhand grip on the slide and a firm grip on the frame, apply force in opposing directions and pull the trigger. Hopefully this will pop the slide off for you:


    Regards,
    Greg
    [<a href=http://i43.tinypic.com/2n7fnux.gif target=_blank>http://i43.tinypic.com/2n7fnux.gif</a>

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    love your detailed pics Greg always top notch👍
    RIP Muggsy

  9. #9
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    Greg,

    Third try's a charm! I got the slide off but not the way you described above. I did give it another try and I guess I applied at least 50 pounds of force with both hands and the slide would not budge. Then I noticed with my gun silhouetted against the bright screen of my LCD TV, that the recoil springs were not parallel to the barrel. If you hold it up against a light, you can see some daylight between the front of the slide and the frame. And what you should see is the top of the recoil springs flush against the barrel. With my gun, it appeared that the heel of the guide rod had dropped down a bit somehow, so that the recoil springs angled downward and away from the barrel progressing from front to back. So I took a piers and was able to pull on the front of the guide rod and manipulate it back into the proper position so that the recoil springs were visibly parallel to the slide again, and the slide came right off as it should.

    The problem now is that when I reassemble the gun I have exactly the same problem all over again. The guide rod/recoil spring assembly gets hung up on the frame somehow and protrudes forward a quarter inch when fully assembled. And then the heel of the guide rod invariably drops down again making it impossible to remove the slide without being manipulated with the pliers. I've done this now three or four times. Since the slide, recoil springs and guide rod all seem normal, I have to assume the problem is with the frame. I can see the spot in the frame below the metal rails where the heel of the guide rod is supposed to sit, and for some reason my guide rod is not able to get there. If I had to guess, I would say the frame is warped somehow.

    So unless I am missing something, I am now more inclined than ever to send it back to Kahr for repair/replacement. I desperately want to like this gun and to be able to trust it for concealed carry. But so far, it has been one problem after another.

    Thanks again,
    Brian

    P.S. I would attach some photos but can't figure out how to do it on this site.
    Last edited by XFlyboy; 08-21-2017 at 09:17 PM. Reason: to add a post script

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by XFlyboy View Post
    Greg,

    Third try's a charm! I got the slide off but not the way you described above. I did give it another try and I guess I applied at least 50 pounds of force with both hands and the slide would not budge. Then I noticed with my gun silhouetted against the bright screen of my LCD TV, that the recoil springs were not parallel to the barrel. If you hold it up against a light, you can see some daylight between the front of the slide and the frame. And what you should see is the top of the recoil springs flush against the barrel. With my gun, it appeared that the heel of the guide rod had dropped down a bit somehow, so that the recoil springs angled downward and away from the barrel progressing from front to back. So I took a piers and was able to pull on the front of the guide rod and manipulate it back into the proper position so that the recoil springs were visibly parallel to the slide again, and the slide came right off as it should.

    The problem now is that when I reassemble the gun I have exactly the same problem all over again. The guide rod/recoil spring assembly gets hung up on the frame somehow and protrudes forward a quarter inch when fully assembled. And then the heel of the guide rod invariably drops down again making it impossible to remove the slide without being manipulated with the pliers. I've done this now three or four times. Since the slide, recoil springs and guide rod all seem normal, I have to assume the problem is with the frame. I can see the spot in the frame below the metal rails where the heel of the guide rod is supposed to sit, and for some reason my guide rod is not able to get there. If I had to guess, I would say the frame is warped somehow.

    So unless I am missing something, I am now more inclined than ever to send it back to Kahr for repair/replacement. I desperately want to like this gun and to be able to trust it for concealed carry. But so far, it has been one problem after another.

    Thanks again,
    Brian

    P.S. I would attach some photos but can't figure out how to do it on this site.
    Well done Brian, it's good to read that you figured out a way to get the slide off. I'll definitely try to file that away for future reference

    The problem you seem to be having with the guide rod not fitting easily into it's seat pretty much parallels this recent discussion:http://www.kahrtalk.com/showthread.p...-Out-the-Front

    Looking back at that now, I see the OP was also having a hard time taking his pistol apart. My apologies for not bringing that up here.
    I posted some photos on page two of that thread, but also see now something that might have been helpful there (maybe here as well).
    I don't have any issues with my P380 in regards to how the guide rod seats in the frame. What I noticed in the photos I posted is that the leading edges of that pocket the rod seats in are beveled on my gun. I don't think it's too much of a reach to think that bevel might aid installation of the guide rod while also making the edge less likely to deform causing issues during disassembly.
    Here's one of those photos with arrows added to point at the spots where the bevel is visible:


    Speaking of photos, you have to have made 30 posts before you can use the attachment feature on this board. Otherwise, images need to be hosted off site and linked here. Posting the images using BB code and the images url works well: [img]image url[/img]
    I've been using https://postimages.org of late and like it. They even provide a properly coded hotlink you can just copy and paste here.

    TheLastDaze,
    Thank you for the kudos...very much appreciated

    Regards,
    Greg
    Last edited by gb6491; 08-22-2017 at 10:40 PM.
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