CW45 Trigger is "dead"? Help needed!

[OMCHamlin]

I have had a CW45 for a long time, shot well, never gave me any issues. Went to pull it out of the safe yesterday, cleared it and dry fired it, the trigger had normal spring tension, but pulling it to the rear did not cause the striker/firing pin to release, or in short, "nothing happened" other than the trigger traveled back to the rear of the frame and when released, returned forward. During the trigger stroke, I can feel a slight hitch or bump in the early part of the trigger stroke, but it does nothing, it's like it's slipping by. I had to gut the slide from the rear to remove it from the frame.

Kahr CS said they would either sell me the five possible parts that could be causing this, and I can swap them out, or I can ship it back to them for service. I would like to hear from the more experienced Kahr owners that have seen issues like this and get your input as to what the culprit might be, or what to visually inspect. I am not unfamiliar with working on firearms, but I have not been very deep in a Kahr before.

Thanks in advance for any assistance you might be able to provide.

[BirdsThaWord]

Welcome to the forum! I will try to walk you through some possible issue causing stuff, listing the easiest to check first...

Do you use grease? Could be that the firing pin safety is gummed, with caked grease, residue, brass flakes, etc. preventing the bump on the trigger bar (disconnector) from actuating it. Pull the slide and see if you can press it in with your finger. (see 1st pic).Given that the only thing that has changed since the last time you shot it is that time has gone by, I would say a thorough cleaning and degunking may be in order.

I was also going to guess the disconnector on the trigger bar could be rounded off (had a Bernadelli with that issue) preventing it from tripping the safety, but most likely not if it shot fine last time you used it. But since it is a possibility, with the slide off look at the rounded little tab that sticks up from your trigger bar that actuates/trips the safety. (See pic with red circle). Make sure it is not overly worn down. I have no idea just how used your gun is, as it would take a LOT of usage to wear that down.

Also, your little plate on the side of your grip may have worn from usage as the trigger bar can rub it thin, or can bulge it outward over time. Along the same lines, the little plate may have been removed at one point and not reinstalled tightly. Either of these (worn plate/trigger bar cover or the plate/cover being loose or bulged) would allow the trigger bar to move around too much, allowing it to travel away from the safety, so that the little trigger bar bump (disconnector) is no longer aligning with the safety to actuate it. See last pic.

Lastly, here’s a related, past thread about this kind of stuff, with a similar issue and another thing to check. Rather than rewrite it all, it was easier just to copy and paste the link. The moderator that gave the solution with pics really knows his stuff and I would be willing to guess that this is the most likely culprit over everything I wrote above:
http://www.kahrtalk.com/showthread.p...y-fails-to-arm
In that thread, and in the last pic below, you’ll see a spring that pushes the trigger bar upward. If that spring is not in it’s proper place, it would allow the trigger bar too not return fully upward. Same as what I mentioned above about the side plate being overly worn or improperly installed, that spring would also not have a tight fit and it’s function can/could be effected.
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[getsome]

Hello OMCHamlin and welcome to Kahrtalk, sorry about the problem with your pistol and BirdsTheWord gives good advice and like he said, I have to wonder since it shot fine until you put it it in the safe and suddenly it started having issues I would think it was gummed up with old lube or dirt so since you were able to get the slide off you are ahead of the game what with having a trigger issue so before doing anything else I would spray the frame and trigger bar assembly out with a can of non chlorinated brake cleaner along with blowing out the striker clean out hole on the bottom of the slide and use some compressed air if possible to blow everything out and then do it again……..I found out the hard way that some gun lubes do not get along well and when I mixed CLP and Rem Oil to clean a S&W 686 revolver it turned into glue and locked up the action so it’s possible your pistol is just needing a good clean out…….After throughly spraying out the frame and slide, try reassembling it without any lube and see if trigger function returns which I think it might and if so lightly lube it up and go shooting but if the problem persists, lightly lube it and send it back to Kahr and let them figure it out because you shouldn’t have to throw replacement parts at it trying to get it to function properly…….Good luck, hope this helps and again, welcome to Kahrtalk……Let us know what happens……

[OMCHamlin]

Thanks Bird', this looks like the red meat I was looking for, I will have my morning coffee, then another, then dissect your procedure, step by step and check each item. Afterwards, I'll come edit this post with my findings.

easiest to check first...
FOR CLARITY, MY REPLIES WILL BE CAPS/BOLD

Do you use grease? NO, USUALLY MILTEC 1 WEAPONS OIL. Could be that the firing pin safety is gummed, with caked grease, residue, brass flakes, etc. preventing the bump on the trigger bar (disconnector) from actuating it. Pull the slide and see if you can press it in with your finger. (see 1st pic). YES, MOVES FREELY WITH LIGHT, BUT POSITIVE SPRING RETURN TO DOWN POSITION. I would say a thorough cleaning and degunking may be in order. I'MA GWAN DO DAT ANYWAYS, MAKES GUD SENSE...

I was also going to guess the disconnector on the trigger bar could be rounded off (had a Bernadelli with that issue) preventing it from tripping the safety, but most likely not if it shot fine last time you used it. But since it is a possibility, with the slide off look at the rounded little tab that sticks up from your trigger bar that actuates/trips the safety. (See pic with red circle). Make sure it is not overly worn down. I have no idea just how used your gun is, as it would take a LOT of usage to wear that down. AGREE, IT SHOULD TAKE WAAAY MORE THEN I'VE SHOT THIS GUN, OR BE MADE OUT OF SOFT ALUMINUM! BUT, VISUALLY INSPECTED; SAT.

Also, your little plate on the side of your grip may have worn from usage as the trigger bar can rub it thin, or can bulge it outward over time. Along the same lines, the little plate may have been removed at one point and not reinstalled tightly. FIT OF PLATE TO FRAME INSPECTED; SAT. TESTED VISUALLY, THREADED FASTENER NOT STRIPPED, TACTILE MOVEMENT OF TRIGGER BAR LOBE INDICATED ONLY MINIMAL (TO NO) SIDE TO SIDE MOVEMENT AND NOT IMPAIRED IN FORE TO AFT MOVEMENT. Either of these (worn plate/trigger bar cover or the plate/cover being loose or bulged) would allow the trigger bar to move around too much, allowing it to travel away from the safety, so that the little trigger bar bump (disconnector) is no longer aligning with the safety to actuate it. See last pic. SEE ABOVE.

Lastly, here’s a related, past thread about this kind of stuff, with a similar issue and another thing to check. Rather than rewrite it all, it was easier just to copy and paste the link. The moderator that gave the solution with pics really knows his stuff and I would be willing to guess that this is the most likely culprit over everything I wrote above:
http://www.kahrtalk.com/showthread.p...y-fails-to-arm
In that thread, and in the last pic below, you’ll see a spring that pushes the trigger bar upward. If that spring is not in it’s proper place, it would allow the trigger bar too not return fully upward. Same as what I mentioned above about the side plate being overly worn or improperly installed, that spring would also not have a tight fit and it’s function can/could be effected. THAT WAS A GREAT DIS/RES DESCRIPTION, WHICH I COPIED TO KEEP, THANKS! THE SPRING SEEMS POSITIONED PROPERLY AND PROVIDING PROPER UPWARD TENSION ON THE TRIGGER BAR.
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86F4BD54-F61F-46FA-8CEC-233470A625A3.jpg
7BA0E9E6-D1C0-4DDC-BECE-98E926CA3850.jpg

Also, by slipping the empty slide back on, I can clearly see the trigger bar contacting the FP safety and moving it up and out of the way. Sooo now what?

[BirdsThaWord]

It sounds like a striker issue, not a trigger issue. As getsome suggested, you would next want to get that striker channel cleaned out. I recently purchased a used CW45. No issues, but I wanted to give it a good cleaning for safe measure. When I cleaned out the striker channel probably 100 or so brass flakes came out. The firing pin hole allows the bullets primer brass to enter into the striker channel. That, along with old lube/grease and gunpowder residue can gum up the works. When you remove the slide rear plate and get at the striker components you may even discover something else, but I doubt it again being that time passing was the only change from the last time you shot it. Let us know if you need help getting that stuff disassembled for cleaning.
If it wasn’t only for the time thing, there are a few components in the striker compartment that could be broken. Once you get it apart it would be obvious if anything is broken. Again, let us know if you need any help if you are unsure how to go about that stuff.
As a side note, I do not put any lube into my striker channels as I don’t want it being a sticky place for stuff. I think the Kahr strikers are pretty slick from the factory, so I am not concerned about them being grabby in there.

[BirdsThaWord]

One quick check...
If you push in the safety, can you push the striker towards the muzzle so that the firing pin protrudes through the firing pin hole?

[Bawanna]

As a standard function check I generally push the striker safety down and shake the slide. You should hear it rattle. I did this a lot with dept Glocks. No rattle, you got sticky or an issue in the striker channel.

[OMCHamlin]

Okay, I'm going to post a pic or two of this gun, internally. Prepare to be underwhelmed at my photography skilz...
[IMG][/IMG]

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[IMG][/IMG]

The slide is clean, dry and reassembled without issue, I am wondering about these surfaces, if they are causing the striker to slip past without any pickup at all. I did manage to get it to dry fire twice upon reassembly, but after that it would just start to pick up the striker and then slip by, resulting in a "dead trigger".

[BirdsThaWord]

I see nothing obvious by the pics you’ve provided. Do this:
Watch this video from the 4 minute mark to the 9 minute mark and do what he shows to disassemble and remove your striker assembly and firing pin assembly.
https://youtu.be/mi3VFRll2L4
Clean everything you’ve removed with some sort of gun cleaning solvent. You should clean everything to the point that there is no more black stuff, brass flakes, etc coming off/away on your cleaning cloth, patches, etc. (watch various youtube vids about cleaning guns if you are unaware of what materials or cleaning agents to use)
The little tunnel in the slide that you removed all of these parts from REALLY needs to be cleaned as well. That tunnel is known as your striker channel. Use a combination of gun cleaning solvent and gun cleaning patches, (I like Q tips dipped in solvent), etc until you see no more brass flakes, black stuff, etc coming out of it. You want that area “as clean as a whistle”
Once you have everything clean, start this video at the 3 minute mark and and reassemble everything.
https://youtu.be/mi3VFRll2L4
Unless you saw any of those components or pieces broken, now go and try to shoot it. By the way, I never recommend dry firing any gun on an empty chamber. Get a Snap Cap or laser training cartridge if you want to pull your trigger without a round in the gun. I’ll let you do your own research on why you don’t want to dry fire on a chamber with nothing for a striker, hammer, etc to fall against.
If nothing was broken and you now have all of these components clean and reassembled properly you should now be in business. If you have watched both vids and have done what I have said then you SHOULD be good to go. If you have done all of this and do not have a trigger still let me/us know.
By the way, if you accidentally remove any of your extractor components and want to know how to put them back in, or in case you want to clean those components as well, watching the 2 vids I’ve linked in full will show you what you need to know as well.
If anyone reading this feels I've left anything out or that I’ve over simplified things, fell free to chime in and add anything you may feel to be of value to the dead trigger situation. : )

[OMCHamlin]

Thanks, Bird, I'll do that. It is hard for me to imagine how this gun went from ridiculously, boringly reliable to "dead trigger" function overnight, seemingly with no causative factors in between? Unnerving to think that I functioned checked, live fired and carried this for a while just a year ago...
I WANT to resolve this myself (with your guy's advice, of course), but I guess if this doesn't get it, it's going to Kahr. I WILL keep this one, it's a very shootable (normally) compact, easy to carry .45, and it's nice to have one of those around!
Heck, I even just went and cruised Kahr's website, and I think the PM is too small, this size is simply a perfect compromise between carry-ability and shoot-ability.