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I apologize in advance if this topic has already been covered, but reading several recent posts has raised this question in my mind: Stopping power of chambered rounds...Are JHP's superior to FMJ's... and what do LEO's use? Are LEO's even permitted to use JHP rounds?
While the whole issue of "stopping power" will undoubtedly be discussed in anecdotes and lead to a caliber war, I can say for sure the LEOs use HP. There are lots of rounds which are specifically marketed as LE ONLY.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ubaldo99
HPs attempt to avoid over penetration. They expand and deliver more energy to the inside of the target. They are safer in that innocent bystanders will not be hit but also it will take fewer shots to stop a threat.
Certain rounds in the Winchester Ranger line and the Federal HST line are only sold to LE. There are others.
It is possible to buy them if a dealer gets an over run on an unfullfilled order. I buy 'em.
A jhp will have more stopping power because all of its energy is transferred to the target. A fmj has the potential of punching through, thus wasting energy on whatever is behind your target.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ubaldo99
Yes, leos use jhp. The military uses fmj but I believe it's because of rules, not preference.
Sent from my Nook Tablet CM7 using Tapatalk.
from WikipediaQuote:
Originally Posted by beatlesfan
Legality
The Hague Convention of 1899, Declaration III, prohibits the use in warfare of bullets that easily expand or flatten in the body.[3] This is often incorrectly believed to be prohibited in the Geneva Conventions, but it significantly predates those conventions, and is in fact a continuance of the St. Petersburg Declaration of 1868, which banned exploding projectiles of less than 400 grams, as well as weapons designed to aggravate injured soldiers or make their death inevitable. NATO members do not use small arms ammunition that is prohibited by the Hague Convention.
Despite the ban on military use, hollow-point bullets are one of the most common types of civilian and police ammunition, due largely to the reduced risk of bystanders being hit by over-penetrating or ricocheted bullets, and the increased speed of incapacitation. In many jurisdictions, even ones such as the United Kingdom, where expanding ammunition is generally prohibited, it is illegal to hunt certain types of game with ammunition that does not expand
I'm issued and carry a Glock 21 as a duty weapon. Off duty I carry either a PM9, M&P 45C or Kimber Ultra CDP II. As a duty round I'm issued Speer Gold Dot 200 grain +P GDHP. For off duty I carry the same round in my 45's and the Speer Gold Dot 124 grain +P GDHP in the PM9.
Thank you, Mser, for your response. Those are some stout rounds.
Hey, MSER, thanks for the post. I'm curious are those the Short Barrel Gold Dots or the standard +P GDs that you carry in the PM9?Quote:
Originally Posted by mser
We are issued Speer Gold Dot JHPs (180 grain 40 cal). Required to use the same in our off duty pistols.
FMJs often do not expand and can overpenetrate.
the potential for an HP rnd to hang up is greater than FMJ rnd. Have to get a rnd out of the hole first before worrying about balistics. I threw this out there b/c I use FMJ for my SD rnds. I shoot FMJ and train with it so I carry it. Flame suit is on. I know HP is probably better. Does anyone have gel results of 40 and 45 cal shot at 7 feet? Does the closeness of the rnd to target deminish the HP function? Or does it still penetrate but leaves a bigger wound.
Due to availability/price, I switched from Bonded Remington Golden Sabers to Speer Gold Dots. I use the Short Barrel version for my Kahrs. They are designed to give the same performance from a shorter barrel.
9mm: 124-gr GD SB +P
.40 S&W: 165-gr GD I chose the 165-gr weight and the SB is only available in 180-grain
.45 ACP: 230-gr GD SB
I also buy the 50-round boxes of Gold Dots because they are cheaper for practice and to use in my 5" .45's.
Speer Gold Dot Ammo: http://www.speer-ammo.com/products/short_brl.aspx
Ballistics: http://www.speer-ammo.com/ballistics/ammo.aspx
Actual Testing Videos of Windshield/Denim/Gelatin: http://www.kiesler.com/videodetail.aspx?id=1534
The BONDED Remington Golden Sabers are great, but became hard to find. If you consider that, be sure that you get the Bonded Remington Golden Sabers. BJHP is Brass Jacketed Hollow Point. The BONDED stuff has a golden label on the box:
http://www.remingtonle.com/ammo/gshpj_b.htm
I've seen the regular Golden Sabers listed as Bonded because of the BJHP. Look at the Box or the product number, which has a "B" in it.
For "real world" chronograph testing and muzzle energy comparisons, check out Ballistics by the Inch:
http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/index.html
Wynn:)